So is that racist or???
Mar 12th, 2008 by admin
I’ve had this blog post in my head for quite some time. And now it’s surfacing again because of this whole weird presidential election junk going on. Let me just start off by saying that I’m going to have a heck of a time deciding who to vote for cuz quite frankly, none of the choices are too appealing to me right now - I think the 3 frontrunners, Mrs. Clinton, Mr. Obama and Mr. McCain all leave more than a lot to be desired when it comes to the issues that matter to me. So none of them will get my vote.
I appreciated what Chele had to say here although I disagree that we should make Oprah run… that’s just scary!
But that’s a separate blog post… it only ties in because I’m hearing comments like “I’m going to vote for Obama because he’s African American” or “I’m gonna vote for Clinton because she’s a woman”, etc. Like either of those things have anything to do with whether or not a candidate will be a good leader of a country. I’m fairly confident that no one is saying “I’m voting for McCain because he’s got blue eyes.”
Anyway, a little history about why this post has been mulling in my head for quite some time, even before all the election hullabuloo (is that a real word?).
A while back I was reading on a blog that just totally disgusted me. I wrote about it briefly because it really is everything bad about the internet all in one place. A bunch of gossipy women with very strong opinions who quite obviously had/have nothing better to do than comment back and forth and spew garbage and assumption about people they don’t even know.
Part of their conversation centered on someone who they obviously didn’t like - none of them knew him personally but someone saw something on the internet (and we all know that if you see something on the internet it MUST BE TRUE - ugh) about him that made him out to be a racist. The bottom line was this guy wrote a pretty strong blog about a lot of different topics (not race related at all) and occasionally a commenter who is supposedly a racist would comment agreeing with him on something totally unrelated to race, etc - I don’t really know the details but the bottom line was this was guilt by association.
Anyway the conversation got all into this whole topic of racism and specifically about how white people only go to white churches, blah blah blah… and I couldn’t help but think - “Hang on a minute … is that really racist or…”
Now hang with me here because I know … I KNOW there is probably someone who is reading this already has the back of the hairs of their neck standing on end.
I will not and can not respect anyone who determines that someone is “less than” because of the color of their skin, shape of their eyes, lack of ability to walk… anything. If you’re a human being - and I’m assuming if you’re reading this you are a human being - then, you and I, we are related through Mr. and Mrs. Noah and we’re both created in the image of God. Period.
That said, something happened at the Tower of Babel and God split us all up - and when He did, things changed. That’s a fact - we’re different - different languages, different skin tone, different likes and dislikes because of the culture in which we live - even though we’re all related.
My husband is Chinese - it’s obvious by the shape of his eyes. He likes certain foods that I wouldn’t touch with a 10 foot pole because of his culture and upbringing. I’m Dutch - it’s obvious because I am as tall as a giraffe and I have typical round dutch blue eyes. We come from a culture that likes Chocolate. Tee hee! My kids are gorgeous - because we of two different races decided to breed. Yay us! 
But I digress…
Ok, so here’s where my thinking went as I was reading some of these ladies comments on what they considered racist:
My folks came over on the big cruise ship from Europe and the first thing they did when they moved to the Chicago area was look for a group of dutch people to socialize with. They started going to a church with other dutch folks (English speaking but mostly people of dutch descent). Are people who aren’t dutch welcome in their circle? Of course. Do they have a lot of non-dutch people that hang with them when they’re in the dutch circle? No. Most dutch folks hope their kids find dutch spouses - I know many who do. Are the dutch folks being racist? Most people would say they’re not.
Hubs folks came over from Taiwan and though they lived with non-Chinese folks when they moved to the Chicago area they have always sought out Chinese doctors, lawyers, etc., and attend church where the services are held in Chinese so only Chinese speaking people go there. Would a non-Chinese person be welcome at their church? Of course! (I actually loved singing “How Great Thou Art” at one of the services - so cool to know we were all singing the same thing even though I couldn’t understand a word of what they were singing!) Would a non-Chinese person want to stay at that church? Probably not - even if the services were in English rather than Chinese. Are the chinese folk racist? Most people would say not.
There are whole areas of downtown Chicago that are completely Polish. When someone new comes here from Poland they seek out other Polish folks, eat at Polish delis, etc. When they worship, they look for a church with other Polish people. Are non-Polish people welcome at their church? Probably. Will a non-Polish person likely stay at that church after a visit or two. Probably not. Are these polish people racist? Most people would say not.
My dentist and his wife are Ukrainian. When they talk about things they talk about Ukies and doing things with their community which is made up of mostly people somehow descended from the Ukraine. Their kids learned Ukrainian dances, went to Ukrainian classes all here in the area and socialized with other Ukrainian kids. Their parents hope that their children will marry Ukrainian spouses too. Are my friends racist? Nope.
There are areas of downtown Chicago full of people with dark skin from various places. When they moved to this area, they intentionally sought out other dark skinned folks to live with and socialize with. They attend churches that have only dark skinned folks attending. Would a non-dark skinned person be welcome at their church? Probably. Would that non-dark skinned person decide to continue going to that church? Probably not. Many dark skinned parents hope their children marry dark skinned spouses. Are these dark skinned people racist? Most people would say not.
There are areas of Chicago that are mostly light skinned people from various places. When another light skinned person moves to the area, they intentionally seek out other light skinned people to live with and socialize with. They attend churches that have light skinned folks attending. Would a non-light skinned person be welcome at their church. Probably. Would that non-light skinned person decide to continue to attend that church? Probably not. Many light skinned people hope that their children marry light skinned spouses. Are the light skinned people racist? Hmmmm… all of a sudden things change? According to the ladies commenting on the blog I was reading it’s a different story.
Why is it that only in the last case the folks MUST be racist? Now I’m not saying there aren’t a whole lot of light skinned people on the planet that ARE racist. There are - and it stinks. But why is it perfectly ok, according to these ladies, to have a church where the folks are “proud that it’s a black church” - and it’s perfectly ok to change out the word “black” for any other skin color or nationality but when you say “white” - boom - they’re a bunch of racists?
I’m frustrated. I hesitate to even publish this because I know - I KNOW - there will be those who read and don’t get it. My point is that people do tend to “group” with similar groups…just because the do so doesn’t mean they’re automatically racist.
So I guess I wonder - what exactly does it mean to be racist? Am I right in my “definition” above - that a racist is someone who determines that someone is “less than” because of the color of their skin, their nationality, religious beliefs or disability? Help me out here.
WOW DEEP! Ok, Well I am African American (well, thats what I check off when I have a choice to choose a race) but common sense tells us all that I am mixed up just like everyone ELSE in the World..LOL
When I think about people who ONLY seek out other people that look like them to live near, associate with or allow their children to be around I dont concider them racist but I do say to myself ” wow there are so many FLAVORS of humans, why onlly look at, talk to and be with just one…LOL
To me a Racist is a person of ANY COLOR/RACE that looks down upon other racists or holds their race up higher than other just “because”. Because of their color, eyes, skin, food tastes, clothing, dialect, religion…. ” That to me is a Racist.
Now coming from a black woman HELL yes it pisses me off when I associate with people via phone and then meet them in person and they say “WOW, you are BLACK” “I thought you were White because you speak so well”. I say to that “what do you mean” Then I get the ole’ “Well you speak very PROPER for a black woman” (UHHHH that is like nails on the chalk board).
I think that many times people fall into sterotypes of groups of people and they pass them on down to their children. Hell, we are all different. I am BLACK and I hate Pig Feet and Chittlins’, I know some Chinese people that aren’t fond of RICE and I have plenty of white friends that don’t like Sea food. What does that say… we are all individuals, we don’t fall into a box, you can’t group us up like cattle and brand us.
*sigh* ok, this got long but I hope I got my point out there somewhat eloquently (smile)
Tough question, Annette.
But in your story, you chose the words “light-skinned” and I’m not sure what that means. That is simply a color.
The other examples you gave involved culture, language, etc. - but you’ve thrown me off on “light-skinned”. What would bring “light-skinned” people together?
Thanks Aurelia. I agree with you - we used to joke with my parents when we were little “Do we ALWAYS have to hang out with Dutch people Dad?” Thankfully we expanded our horizons a bit thanks to our neighborhood. Dutch was my first language though since my parents didn’t speak English when they got here and most of their friends were in the same boat.
My kids will have a challenge when they’re asked the race question of course too. I guess they’re Chutch or Dunese?
I could say SO very much on this Annette. I admit, I have a website/forum that is specifically for Malaysians who live outside of that country. Why? Not because I want to alienate anyone. I invite friends of all shapes, sizes, races all the time. But it exists mostly as a support group to help adjust to our adopted country. 90% of our members are married to spouses of different races and not all are white mind you. So race it’s not an issue it’s about being able to ‘relate’. Like when I say ‘roti’ you know exactly what I am referring to.
Outside of that, I don’t really care what you are outside and concur with your definition.
Like Aurelia, stereotypes get to me as well. I am tall. Admittedly, you don’t see many tall Asian women but I would appreciate people not drop their jaw when I stand up and tower over them. I have plenty of Asian friends (women) who are taller than I am so I know I am not a freak of nature. I also do not have size 1 feet thank you very much. Oh and talking about feet, I don’t wash my husband’s feet. If he wants to wash his feet, he (or any man) can wash it himself.
WOW! What a raw post yet very necessary. Let me start out by saying that I am an African American woman and that I am not a racist, never have been and pray that I never appear to be such.
Annette I think your definition of a racist is pretty on point and yet we misconstrue it so many times. I did go to am all AA church for over 14 years and we did have people from other cultures, yep we sure did. I refuse to say “different races” because God created on race…the human race. Anyway, I also hung with a mostly AA crowd most of my life because you know what…that is who was around me where I grew up, went to school, etc.
You just tend to migrate towards what you know. That in no way makes someone racist. It just makes them who they are and what they grew up with.
I have never not chosen to be around someone who is not the came color as me. For me it is all about what is on the inside. Even after being looked down upon because of my skin tone (a very pretty caramel if I should say so myself), I never looked at someone with hate. My parents did not raise me like that. And they both came from an era where they had reasons to do so, but they did not.
I agree with Aurelia. Getting looked down is painful but you know what it is also, unfortunately, a part of life.
I have purposely set out in my life to make sure that I look beyond what’s on the outside and focus on what is on the inside.
Funny thing is after doing some research I discovered that I am actually more Indian than AA and that I have Irish, African, and even French in me. So I guess maybe that just makes me a pretty mutt…LOL
I think this is an issue that needs to be discussed more. Thanks Annette for being so darn bold!
Alice when I read “light skinned” I assumed she was talking about African Americans. Light vs. Dark skinned AA’s is a HUGE issue that many AA’s have believe it or not.
But, I could be wrong.. Annette - can you explain what you meant by light skinned?
Yeah I guess she does need to explain because I thought she was just making a point on we separate ourselves with the “dark/light” reference.
Alice, I think you just made my point if you read that light skinned means “white”? The only difference between the paragraph with “light-skinned” and the one above it is that I used the word “light” instead of “dark” before “skinned”. So in your comment would you also say that “dark skinned” threw you off - what is it about the dark skin color that necessarily would throw them together?
Is the assumption that all darker skinned people come from the same culture? I don’t think so. I’m assuming that darker skinned people from Africa have different cultures, tastes, etc, than a darker skinned person from Jamaica - and probably would be so bold as to say that someone from Johannesburg would have drastically different thoughts/ideas, etc. than someone from say, Zimbabwe though they’re both from the same continent. Like LaTara said above - it’s the cultural differences.
That said, my skin is not white - it would be considered light skinned I suppose. I think of it more like beige or sometimes mauve if I’m blushing and sometimes in the summer if I spend a lot of time in the garden (or in my youth when I was trying to get skin cancer by laying out in the sun with baby oil), I’m pretty much closer to dark skinned.
For the most part, like Latara said, most of us are just mutts anyway - a wonderful blend of many cultures, colors, etc. And, like I said before, we all are related via Mr. and Mrs. Noah anyway (or if you want to go farther back, Adam and Eve).
I surprise people now if they talk to me on the phone and I say my name is Yen - then I walk up - this big ole tall dutch girl. Throws them off! Makes me smile!
Anyway I didn’t mean to confuse the issue more. My struggle with the ladies on that horrible blog was that in one breath they were saying how horrible it is for a church of mostly white people (for lack of a better term) to not have a single black member and that it’s proof that they’re racist and then in the very next breath applaud the local black church for being proud that they’re all black. Why is one skin color considered racist and the other isn’t?
And back to the election - why is it ok for someone to say “I’m voting for Obama because he’s black” but someone would get reamed if they said “I’m voting for McCain because he’s white”?
Thanks for the comments ladies.
I agree with you Annette it’s not fair for minority groups to congregate together and to show preference for one another over others based on color and for that to be perfectly fine, but when white’s choose to do so it is considered racist. It’s wrong but… we know why the feelings run strong in that regard and it’s not just a color thing it’s a “minority” thing.
We have a long nasty history in the Western hemisphere of a white dominated society discriminating against non-whites and even other whites (think Catholics at the turn of the Century right up until President Kennedy’s election). I think we have overcome a lot over the years but in reality it’s only been barely 40 years or so since steps were taken to protect the civil rights of minorities. I think in time we’ll get over this. But for the time being that explains the double standard.
I guess I don’t see this election as being that frustrating - every candidate has flaws. Think back to Bush, Reagan, Nixon - good grief they were full of flaws but the nation is still standing and some people think those two were the cats meow. I think almost every one of our Candidates right now stand up well and in many cases better than some past presidents (based on what we know now).
By the way I’m a black woman born in the UK of West Indian descent, raised in Canada, lived in the U.S and married to a black American. I love the diversity and don’t see our debates as all that problematic. We’re just human and we’re trying to understand one another - that’s miles ahead of where we were 40+ years which isn’t that long ago at all.
Good post Annette - thank you for the dialogue
Oh wow Annette, you said so much I wish I would have had the guts to say at some point. Girl I’m with you. I am white, I live in rural, SOUTHERN, MIssissippi where every white person who walks the streets is considered a racist. I am by no means racist. I went to public school and had African American friends, other cultures aren’t represented here much. I did however, grow up in and still attend a completely white church. Many could say it is racist. But you know what all the black people I know around here go to all black churches just as much as the white people around here go to all white churches, it’s just the way it is around here.
As for the election, I think it’s idiotic to vote for someone based on their sex or race. I too agree that there is only the lesser of 3 evils in the case of those who are running, I do not think any of them are just real perfect candidates, to me they all leave a bit to be desired.
Thanks for the great post Annette, I know that there is more I could say but I am having trouble formulating my thoughts tonight.
I actually missed the “dark skinned” paragraph completely somehow. Yeah, both get my attention because that is skin-color and nothing else. I didn’t necessarily read “light skinned” as white, because it could mean a lot of things. And it was all based on color in my estimation.
Of course, within all the groups you mentioned that are variables in culture, but there is still some drawing in force other than color.
Anyway, I’m pretty sure you and I agree on the whole idea behind your post. I just got thrown by grouping people solely by color.